Great Gun Stuff Blog

Magnum Research is manufacturing a 1911 which will go on sale next year! Two sized model will be on offer.

Magnum Research has entered the 1911 segment of the handgun market with its first two offerings, a full-size (5.055” barrel) and semi-compact (4.33” barrel) Desert Eagle® 1911 pistol. Both models feature enhanced beavertail safety, skeletonized trigger and hammer, crisp trigger, extended safety lever, beveled magazine well, tightly tolerance frame and slide for enhanced accuracy.

I believe that these pistols will be manufactured in the United States, not imported from Israel.

[ Many thanks to the reader who for emailed me the info. ]

[ I am pleased to present this review of the new Magpul AFG (Angled ForeGrip). The review was written by Isaac. ]

Let me preface this review by first establishing that anything to do with how your body interfaces with a weapon system will not be a review that’s binary in nature. There is no universal ‘this works’ or ‘this does not work’ as empirical facts on these types of products. What feels good to one person feels bad to another.

There’s been a rapid transition from vertical grips being used in the broom-handle sense, i.e hands fully around the column, and thus providing very little stability over the center axis of the rifle. So as the hand moves higher up along the line of the bore (in terms of grip) we’ve found that we need less tall of vertical grips to accomplish that need. A further variation on that is the idea of a hand-stop, which whittles away any unnecessary design to provide only a reference point for the hand to exert rearward pressure on.

The hand-stop concept is fantastic if you run a high tang grip. For me as a shooter I run my reaction side hand (or primary if working transitions) high, to the point where my knuckles are on top of the rail. The one issue that has been raised is the supination to the shooter’s wrist, or the over-extension caused by a hard 90-degree cant on the grip; the AFG works to solve this by using an angled gripping surface for the shooter.

Magpul AFG on Knights 11.5" SBR (Note angle of the wrist in relation to the AFG)

This review was compiled from the experiences of 3 shooters, myself, and two other experienced AR shooters who spent about 100+ rounds on each of my guns (11.5 Costa-style SBR, which is fitting for this test, and my KAC SR-15). Obviously the build quality is fantastic, it’s an affordably made, and well thought out product in terms of execution. The grip comes with two finger groove inserts, one in the A2 style nub, and one that’s smooth. I found for my hands the A2 groove interfered with my smaller hands, and I had to switch out to the flat profile insert (swappable within 1-2 minutes with only removing two screws to separate the AFG in half). The AFG mounts to the rail using a flat head screw and nut, to lock it in to the rail. The AFG takes up approximately the entire length of a standard 7” carbine rail. However you can position it further forward on the rail depending on what feels best for the shooter.

Knights Armament SR-15

So how does it feel? Well…I’d say it’s a mixed bag. My KAC SBR uses a KAC hand-stop, and the longer SR-15 uses a non-QD Tango Down Stubby vertical grip. Each gun has it’s own unique setup as I run two completely different light/laser rigs on each. So lets start with the SR-15 first. On the Knights SR-15 the combination of Surefire Scout, AN/PEQ-15, and Magpul AFG did not feel good for me at all. The previous setup (and keep in mind this is a combination of interactions on different parts) which used the TD Stubby allowed me to slightly extend my left thumb forward to activate the light, and when using the PEQ (pressure pad is directly under the PEQ-15, placed in between the left and top rail) all I have to do is a slight wrist rotation to hit the pressure switch. When the AFG is in place it’s a much more pronounced move to hit the light. And with the PEQ-15 instead of rotating my hand back a few degrees to allow my thumb access to the pad I now have to extend my whole hand out since it’s already canted. Simply put it’s comfortable when shooting, but it’s uncomfortable when trying to work with the light and laser. The AFG also interferes with rail-mounted accessories like Larue mounts. The AFG cannot slide next to them without the user removing part of the AFG with a Dremel. This isn’t a big issue and is user-solvable quickly, but it’s still an issue worth pointing out. Since the review I’ve switched back to the Stubby, and I’ll get back to that in my conclusions.

Magpul AFG used in combination light and laser (Surefire Scout, and Insight Technology AN/PEQ-15)

On the SBR the results were notably better. Because I run my Surefire at the 1 o’clock position this allowed me to better high grip on the AFG, and the results were comfortable, though not perfect. The 11.5” SBR also provides an interesting test bed. As my rifle is very similar to Chris Costa’s (I run a different light setup however) so it’s a situation where my rifle matches up very closely to those in the marketing material. So taking that in to account the biggest differences become the difference in body mechanics between the two shooters.

Magpul AFG on Knights 11.5" SBR

To summarize how the AFG feels, and all the shooters independently confirmed this after our demo (we all came to the same results separately) is that the AFG can be equated to a slippage in physical purchase (grip, not money). I equate it to sitting on your back, feet against the wall, as you push out with your feet you have a solid action/re-action to what you’re pushing against. The AFG feels more like pushing against an angled surface, in that the force is somewhat translated but the force also wants to go up and out. So while it accomplishes the job of pulling back it feels less positive in terms grip. The tango down grip provides a solid 90-degree point of reference for my hands and the hands of the shooters who demoed the AFG (and I can keep an extra 123A battery in the stubby). The same can be said of the KAC hand-stop. I will admit I like the AFG just a tiny bit more over the KAC hand-stop, which is why I’ll continue to use the AFG going forward. However I’ve found that the AFG for me at least was not the right choice for my longer SR-15. I understand the mentality behind the AFG, and I wouldn’t go so far as to say it’s a solution searching for a problem. As I said earlier this is not going to be a binary review, this is however going to be a binary product. You will either love it or hate it. My response to it on it being announced was very mixed bag, my response to it in use is still the same. The human body is absolutely unique among individuals; ergonomics is always about creating a compromise. It’s about making what feels good to the largest percentage of individuals. I’m in the percentage that just barely considers it an improvement.

However at 35 dollars it’s too cheap not to try out for yourself, make these decisions after some range time, and see how it works for yourself. I do want to thank Magpul for allowing me to try one of these out for free, and come to these conclusions myself as impartially as possible.

Earlier this year an H&K employee said, in an interview with Guns America (skip to 1:30), that Heckler & Koch would launch a H&K P30 pistol chambered in .40 S&W in the fourth quarter. So far the pistol has not been seen.

H&K P30 (9mm model)

H&K enthusiasts have confirmed that a .40 S&W P30S/LS and P30/L will be launched at SHOT Show.

UPDATE:

Confirmed! Bubs Gun Shop is listing the pistols.

There are three .40 S&W models. All have 15 round magazines. Price is $831.

[ Many thanks to a reader for emailing me this infomation. ]

Masterpiece Arms are now selling their MPA (Mac-10 clone) carbines and pistols chambered in the .460 Rowland cartridge.

.460 Rowland 16" barreled carbine.

The .460 Rowland was originally developed a decade ago as a magnum power cartridge suitable for the 1911 pistol. It is about 10% more powerful than the 10mm Auto. I have not seen evidence of the .44 Magnum performance claimed.

This video entertaining video demonstrates the .460 MPA guns. It is worth watching, if only to see the concrete block wall dismantled

.460 Rowland 6" barreled pistol

Prices start at $579 for the pistol and $853 for the carbine.

[Hat Tip: Tactical Life]

There is still time for your gifts to arrive before Christmas. The NRA Store is offering a free upgrade to 3 day shipping on orders over $99. This offer expires on 12/19/09!

Visit the Online Guns Hot Deals page to receive the 3 day shipping upgrade promo code.

- Greg

Promag is manufacturing 10 and 15 round magazines for the sub-compact Kel-Tec P3AT & Ruger LCP

Ruger LCP 15 rounder

Kel-tec P3AT 15 rounder

The 10 rounders cost about $32 and the 20 rounders are going for $35, although you may be able to find them cheaper at other sources.

And now, before you ask "why?", I say "Why Not? ".

[ Many thanks to the reader who sent this in ]

Argentine gun maker Bersa, best known for their Bersa Thunder 380 pistol, will be entering the lucrative compact-plastic-fantastic pistol market next year with the BP9CC, chambered in 9mm, and the BP40CC, chambered in .40 S&W.

Bersa BP9CC

The inspiration for this pistol was the SIG P250. The external appearance and internal organization of parts resemble the P250, but I don't think it also uses the P250's true double action mechanism.

Unfortunately it includes Bersa's anti-features: the dreaded key-lock and magazine safety.

The pistols are slightly larger and heavier than a true sub-compact, such as the Kel-Tec PF-9, so I am unsure if they should be classed as compact or sub-compact.

Some online stores are listing the pistol but at a much lower price than what Lipseys, a major distributor, says. I think $425 sounds right for a pistol of this class.

The long-awaited 7.62x51mm PMAG has finally been given a name and is now in production. At $19.95, Magpul are going to be selling truck loads of these mags.

The PMAG-LR holds 20 rounds of 7.62x51mm or .308 Winchester rounds and is compatible with the following rifles ...

• Mk11 / M110
• KAC SR25
• DPMS LR308
• LMT 7.62 MRP
• LaRue Tactical OBR
• LWRC REPR
• POF P-308

It is not compatible with the AR-10, M14/M1A or SCAR-H.

Interesting, SCAR-H compatibility (or incompatibility) is not mentioned. I am not sure what to make of this omission.

Many thanks to optimus.prime for sending me the information.

UPDATE: Thanks to R.A.W and Rex for SCAR-H info.

There has been much controversy over the Model 597 (.17 HMR) buyback.

Split case neck. A common problem with .17 HMR Model 597 rifles.

For those of you not familiar with the buy back, I will summarize. Back in August Remington finally acknowledged that their .17 HMR semi-automatics had serious issues. They offered a $250 coupon, which could be used towards the purchase of another Remington firearm, for each 597 that was returned to them. A $10 coupon was also offered for each box of ammunition returned. Since then there has been a lot of anger and confusion.

The confusion regarding the .17 HMR cartridge.

This buy back does not mean that the .17 HMR is unsafe in your bolt action, single shot or lever action rifles. The problems occur in semi-automatic rifles. Matt Groom explained in the comments ...

With any bottle necked round, the pressure generated in the body of the case has to be compressed slightly to flow through the smaller diameter of the case neck. This is why the shoulder usually moves forward a tiny bit on rifle cartridges. The gases also accellerate as they travel through the neck area, which can cause the neck to soften and split. This all happens very fast, and is one reason why nearly everything with a bottle neck is fired from a locked breech. The PPSh and other Soviet SMGs are the only things I can think of that use a bottle neck in a blowback action before the modern .17 caliber rimfires came out, and I think those used steel cases.

This was likely the reason that Ruger never launched their once advertised, but never seen, 10/17 rifles.

Hornady .17 HMR V-Max

In September Hornady, who originally developed the cartridge, posted this noticed on their website ...

Recently there have been notices placed on several web sites warning about the use of 17HMR ammunition in semi-automatic firearms. Statements are to the effect of do not use 17HMR ammunition in semi-auto firearms or serious injury may result and do not use unless or until you have contacted the manufacturer of your firearm. Every ammunition manufacturer determines the warning it believes is appropriate for its product.

First and foremost, the safety of our customers is our primary concern, and the same is true for all other SAAMI member companies. We are making this statement to hopefully reduce confusion, answer questions and clarify issues.

We believe 17HMR ammunition is manufactured to the highest standard of care and quality and performs within the specifications established for 17HMR ammunition and is consistent with SAAMI standards for ALL ammunition.

We are not firearms manufacturers and we believe the firearms manufacturers are solely the ones responsible for determining if and how they should market and sell a model or type of firearm. WE STRONGLY URGE YOU TO CONTACT THE MANUFACTURER OF YOUR FIREARM TO DETERMINE IF IT IS SAFE TO USE 17HMR AMMUNITION IN YOUR SPECIFIC TYPE AND MODEL OF FIREARM.

So there you have it. It is safe, but be wary of using the round in a semi-automatic.

The controversy regarding the buy back.

Many owners of recently purchased .17 597 rifles are understandably unhappy about the buy back. Some have paid hundreds of dollars more for the rifle than what Remington is offering in the buy back scheme.

In the comments Rand said ...

A few points, then: 1) Remington’s buy-back offer represents $10 less than what a gun dealer who is unaware that the thing has been recalled will offer for a gun that has blown out its magazine. So you could say it’s a pretty lousy buy-back offer, but you could also say that it’s about right, since you wouldn’t be able to get much more for the gun by selling to someone else. Either way, Remington is not doing anybody any favors.

2) If you read Remington’s recall notice (which I also found when I Googled the thing), you’ll see that it does not admit that there is anything inherently wrong with the round OR the rifle. It says Remington has been “notified” by its “supplier” of 17 HMR ammo that the ammo is unsafe for use in semi-automatic rifles. So Remington offers to buy back its ammo. Then it says, essentially, that because it’s recalling its .17 HMR ammo, it’s also recalling its Model 597 rifles in .17 HMR. But why recall the rifles when the problem is the ammo? This is classic CYA legal language, pure and simple. I was in fact shooting Hornady ammo in my son’s rifle when it blew out the magazine.

Overseas customers are worse off as they have to pay much higher prices for their rifles, but are being offered the same buy back. Pat Gallagher said ...

I live in Ireland were we are screwed cost wise for just about everything, I bought a Remy 597 in .17hmr about 12 months ago.I paid 700.00 euro for it, approx 1040.00us dollars and am being offered the same deal as you guys recall value, and you guys are pissed!.

Shooters affected by the buy back have been emailing and snail-mailing Remington, complaining to the BBB, organizing an online petition and threatening legal action.

In the comments Joe argued that, on the whole, Remington are being fair ...

Having worked at Remington for over 40 years and retired I know that the company does everything possible to produce a quality product. As with any other industry sometimes new products don’t live up to expectations for one reason or another,the 597 .17 being a good example.I am also aware that no matter what reconciliation is offered it won’t satisfy everybody. many of the issues raised in the forum are justified and I think the company will be fair in their response.The thing that bothers me is the talk of lawyers and lawsuits. With Washington filled with antigun politicians we as gun owners should not be so quick to hobble a company that is in the forefront of protecting the 2nd Ammendment. You may say that I am biased but I would feel the same if it was Winchester,Mossberg or any other American gun maker.

What can Remington do to make this right?

I am going to write an email to my contact at the Freedom Group's Public Relations department and propose that Remington offer to replace any 597 purchased in the past X years with the closest equivalent .22 LR model. Customers could choose to have their 597 replaced or to take the $250 coupon. Sure this is not a perfect solution but I think it is more fair than the current situation.

Do you think Remington is being fair or not?

Just posted a MidwayUSA coupon code on the Online Guns Hot Deals page. This coupon code gives you $10 off orders of $50 or more at MidwayUSA!

The only catch... this coupon code ends at 11:59 PM CT December 6, 2009.

Visit the Online Guns Hot Deals page to find the MidwayUSA coupon code.

- Greg